Troy Gramling is wearing a skeleton. I did not expect that. ;-)

But, loving the fact that he opened the Bible in front of his Mac. Two inspired tools!

Love the message about pride: and, I know Troy, so I appreciate his heart.

Ed

I'm not a church leader in any way. Just moved to Nashville, visiting a church but don't have even any friends there yet and I almost didn't watch this because of the fact I'm just a lone ranger Christian right now.

This message is hitting me right between the eyes. Pride is one of the biggest things I struggle with and even without the leadership angle on this it rings loudly for our lives. My pride is being hammered right now.

I'm glad I heard this.

Pride is seeping in when I have to let you know how important I am - good stuff.

I disagree with this guy('s shirt).

Troy G. Summary

2 Chron 26

Cautions against pride in ministry - it will lead to ruin Watch for four warning signs pointing to pride.

1. Forgetting the gift is bigger than the person
2. Impatience with others
3. Unwilling to hear the truth
4. Symbols of power become important

Overall good word of caution. Nice way to start.

Wish Troy had more time to bring us to the gospel to know how to overcome the pride issue. I am pretty sure I am going to say, "wish they had more time." ;-)

Ed

I love listening to Mark Beeson and getting counsel from an older leader.

We were supposed to speak at an event together once, but nobody signed up and it got canceled! No kiddin'. So, we never met.

Ed

Ed...

Completely agree...would have loved to hear Troy flesh out how pride is rooted out by the gospel...

Also interesting to hear Mark Beeson pretty much say that a big reason folks will or won't join your team (and I think in small churches it holds true as well) is you..

Keller has a similar take in his material on the dynamics of church based on their size...

Just listened to Bryan Carter. I don't know him, but he seems like a good guy.

Good words of practical wisdom from the first few men. Keeping in mind that they only have 9 minutes, I find it interesting that when given a chance to talk to leaders, so far most have focused on the practical and assumed the spiritual.

Now listening to Anne Jackson.

Very transparent talk from Anne Jackson.

Can serving the church interfere with communion with Christ?

Anne's personal story was helpful, expressing the danger of operating in one's own strength and not relying on Christ. Church ministry can put you in the hospital, and lead to idolatry if we aren't checking ourselves. Anne pointed to the spiritual-- abiding in Christ!

Wow...we talk about having a 30 second elevator speech for selling ourselves and/or our products. At best, an elevator is going to hold about 20 people. I can't even imagine the audience these leaders are privileged to serve today.

I look forward to hearing/reading/tweeting what they consider to be essential to them, their ministry, and their views on leadership to share in 9 minutes to an audience spanning over 40 countries!

I am humbled to engage in this exercise myself. If given this opportunity....what would I want to share to THE WORLD if only given 9 minutes to do so. Wow...

I never get as much out of a Christian leader's message as I do when they're being completely transparent and not playing the part of a Christian leader. Anne's talk is inspiring.

Dave Ferguson, one of my favorite people, gives "one big idea" (what a surprise, grin) and it is about apprenticing leaders. Good counsel. Listening to Scott Hodge now.

Focused on a leader's need to hear God's voice every day, and the faith and courage to obey him. This is more critical than innovation, creativity, etc. Good words on taking time to listen to God, be quiet and still before him, and that obeying God in the big things, requires obedience in the small things.

I don't know if it was publicized this way, but this is valuable information for non-leaders too .. future leaders probably aren't, now.

Incidentally this feed seems to be ahead of the TheNines feed

You can't make a wave, God makes 'em. But you can't ride 'em if UR surfboard ain't waxed and you're wetsuit ain't on.

"This is not our church, it's Jesus' church." amen to that.

This stuff ticks with my spirit. My heart burns when I listen to how God moves.

Perry brought a focus on how we can prepare for a move of God, but we can't plan it. Finney would be disappointed. ;-)

Listening to Skye Jethani now. Had the chance to do breakfast a couple of weeks ago in Arizona. Good guy-- and I am a big fan of Leadership Journal.

He explains that it kills your soul to believe: "The larger the impact of our ministry, the more legitimate our ministry."

As a lead pastor of a new church plant that attends 60 right now...it was good to hear Skye say that large DOES NOT EQUAL legitimate...

However, I also recognize that it's not necessarily true that small = more effective either...

Good to hear someone take this angle today!

This is a great concept. I think people will get more from this than a couple of days hearing fewer speakers for longer amounts of time. This should happen more in the future.

One problem: Twitter feed at TheNines site was a little much (thousands twittering at once) and the spam factor was growing since it is #1 trend on twitter, so following comments here is much easier.

"Results based" seems to ignore the Biblical principle that some water, some plant, but God gives the increase. As if God is bound to abide by our schedule.

Skye Jethani lays out the Daisy Cutter doctrine, a lie we believe - that says the larger the impact the more legit the ministry. Judging by this belief, Jesus ministry would be suspect. "Abandon the outcomes to the Lord."

You may not know Steve Robinson of Church of the King (speaking now), but I had the chance to spend the day with him in New Orleans when the Foursquare Church asked me to spend a day consulting with them on their Katrina response. They have a big vision and he has an amazing story.

NITPICK WARNING:

He said "Pharaoh hardened his heart.." (and he chased after the Israelites..).

I believe it was God Who hardened it, not Pharaoh.

"Worry is temporary atheism!" Needed to hear that.

Wow! What a glorious goatee!

A huge AMEN on the temporary atheism. I have NEVER heard a better expression re worrying.

Wow...Stacy Spencer really brought the truth down. When someone's in that pit and they're struggling to get out and can't do it alone...a church leader who just dismisses them is like having that person step on their head.

I wish we could play his clip again for everyone. :)

Having to do some actual work during the day. ;-) Feel free to go on without me!

Senior adults want to do "more than usher." Great word.

Ed --

I tried to find some kind of summary or point for these talks, but I don't see it anywhere. What's the point of this series of talks? Obviously this is for pastoral staff -- why would any pastoral staff want to participate in this series of chats?

I'm not saying these are useless: I'm saying I am not following why some particular church would want to get after these videos.

Is it just me or did Steve Robinson's and Scott Wilson's segments seem opposite philosophically? Robinson's resinated more with me.

Keith,

Seemed that they did not coordinate their talks, eh? ;-)

Ed

She's skirting around one issue .. the fact that the Bible equates age with wisdom, and we do have a storehouse full of that, and many of the old folks (that should be an honored term, not a pejorative one) would love to be involved, but its the church (too many times) that has marginalized them.

Rising in honor before the white head might just include listening to them, and making opportunities to do so.

Ed -

Yeah, I think I'd have put their talks farther away time-wise from each other. Or maybe that was intentional?

All of this is so good. Thank you for posting this. Right now I'm listening talking about "serv-olution". This is so right on. The church is designed to put action to the need.

I spent a week on a mission trip to Costa Rica. Tiny church, very little money...outreaching to their community in complete faith in God's provision to do it.

So right on.

Steven Furtick
"my staff took up a challenge to read through the Bible in 90 days - called B90X"

If more church staffs did this - what might happen in the church today?

Furtick laid down a bold challenge for us to walk in "audacious faith."
Even when the brooks around us are dried up, look up. The challenge we face might be the tool God uses to move us to a new level of faith.

Noel Heikkinen of Riverview Church on the model for a team of elders to lead the church as the New Testament model.

Here's my question to you: If you are a leader, who are you accountable too? How are you leading the church with people instead of for people?

Groeschel on what he is working on with his staff
1. Deeper climate of innovation is always needed
Our values are constant but our culture evolves

2. Utilize gifts in our church family better
If you delegate tasks, you create followers.
If you delegate authority, you create leaders.
BOOM! Read that again!

3. Do ministry out of the overflow of God - a personal challenge for Craig
Even at a forward-thinking church with a forward-thinking pastor, we must constantly assess how they can be used next by the Spirit instead of by our creativity.

A female pastor of ministry of a large sbc church?

I just started watching not long ago, and already I feel as though i've wasted my time. I'm not trying to be pridefull but noting these guys are saying is "new" or "though-provoking." I think if these things are thought provoking then you should probably not be a leader. Why is there a even a need for "The Nines"? Many of us need to get off of the computer, open up our Bibles, conisder our calling, and beg God to reveal himself to us.

Top notch message from Pete Wilson. Transformation can't just be something that stops after you profess Christ and take a dip in the hot tub beside the pastor in the fishing waders.

Cory, some of us find it really refreshing when we don't hear something "new," but rather something needed.

I've enjoyed the guys who are plugging spiritual formation, gospel-centricity, integrity, faithfulness, and study of Scripture. None of that is anything new, but I think it's what church leaders today need to hear.

Back from lunch.

Glad to listen to my friend Larry Osborne.

Larry Osborne's talk with small response:
- the church today is OK - no comment here, today
- faithfulness in Acts was a holy huddle pre-persecution -- the Lord added to their number daily those that were being saved"
- significant racism in Acts regarding Peter going to Cornelius and the church accepting Gentiles -- once the truth revealed, there is no longer reason to claim ignorance or excuse disobedience
- Paul's church plants were messed up -- Paul addressed these issues head-on, but these churches were vibrant in reaching the early world, spreading the gospel of Christ

Cory, I'm not in church leadership but just have a deep longing within me to serve God. Hearing these talks today have encouraged me, uplifted me, challenged me and showed me there are leaders out there who feel as I do on a number of issues.

Why is that such a bad thing? I'm in a new town with no mentors and no strong relationships with Christian brothers (yet.) A lone ranger Christian is ripe to be picked off. If something like this can help, shouldn't we welcome it?

Jim Burgen...knew him years ago when he was in college. He is the real deal; I love that guy!

As a matter of fact, even if we were in the bathroom, I'd hug him too.

Is the schedule posted a bit off? I gotta do real work too but I wanted to catch some of these people. I'm glad I checked and found Larry Osborne on. I almost missed him. I'd hate to miss you Ed.

This is very cool! I wish I had the chance to spend the day live-blogging this on my blog.

May God be glorified and the Church be rectified through these leaders!

Why do most church conferences always make me feel like I suck if I don't want to lead or grow a mega people, mega bucks church???? Sooner or later, regardless of how many speaker say it is not about bucks and butts, it always boils down to butts and bucks. Why must we assume that greatness is equivalent to those scales of economy? Last I check Jesus only led a handful of guys and had what, maybe a couple hundred followers while he was around on earth. I'm just saying... I don't want to lead a mega church, so I probably won't, but don't make me feel like I'm a crappy leader just cause I am not and will not!

Watching Brian McLaren-- very creative presentation.

He talked about what the gospel "is."

Pastors should ask, "What is the Gospel?"

Good question.

His answer: "If you let Jesus define the gospel, it is that the Kingdom of God is at hand."

Your thoughts?

I would add "repent and believe" to "the Kingdom of God is at hand."

I think McLaren his partially correct about that Gospel- but isn't the gospel even more so about the person and work of Jesus? The King of the Kingdom?

If the King had not died and rose again, where would his Kingdom be?

I think McLaren really hit the nail on the head. There is certainly a lot of confusion about what the gospel is, and he is right to say that it is "not an evacuation plan but a transformation plan." As always I think he raised a lot of important questions for church leaders to think about.

Jason,

It certainly was the gospel of Jesus (live in the way of Jesus, etc.), but did not seem to include much at all about the gospel about Jesus-- what He did on the cross, for sin, in our place.

I think the gospel must have a bloody cross and an empty tomb.

Ed

there will never be peace among the faiths...

regardless, we don't know near enough about other religions

Agreed Ed.

"For I decided to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ and him crucified."

That seems to be a radical message today.

I think Len was right when he questioned if large churches = Gospel success. I think we need to wrestle with what success of the Gospel means. I'm not sure I agree 100% with his conclusion but I think it is a valid and needed question

McLaren's gospel is misleading and completely inadequate without the death and resurrection of Jesus for our sin in our place and our unity to him through faith.

I don't think McLaren hit the nail on the head but I think he clearly missed the gospel by saying far too little of what the thrust of the New Testament is. I agree that the gospel is a "transformation plan" in a broad sense, but even granting that the center of this transformation plan is the incarnation, life, death, resurrection, ascension, and return of Jesus Christ and what that death means.

Brian McLaren needs a better understanding of Substitutionary Atonement.

I appreciate guys like McLaren for asking good, challenging questions, and I think he does so with good intentions.

The trouble is that so many become a disciple of him and his questions, instead of Jesus and His Word, which contain/are the answers...

PJ,

I appreciated Brian's desire to see the transformational implications of the gospel of the Kingdom, but felt (at least here in these 9 minutes) there needed to be a stronger focus on the cross.

It is hard to talk about the gospel without thinking about 1 Corinthians 15:1-5:

Now, brothers, I want to remind you of the gospel I preached to you, which you received and on which you have taken your stand. By this gospel you are saved, if you hold firmly to the word I preached to you. Otherwise, you have believed in vain. For what I received I passed on to you as of first importance: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures,

To be fair, it is hard to include everything in 9 minutes (and I am sure people will say that about my upcoming 9 minute presentation). But, I think it is essential to include such a cross-centered definition in any definition of the gospel.

Here is my brief definition I have used in my preaching. It includes a kingdom focus, but must include more than that. Feel free to critique it and help me understand the gospel better.

The gospel is the good news that God, who is more holy than we can imagine, looked upon with compassion, people, who are more sinful than we would possibly admit, and sent Jesus into history to establish his Kingdom and reconcile people and the world to himself. Jesus, whose love is more extravagant than we can measure, came to sacrificially die for us so that we might gain through His grace what the Bible defines as eternal life through His death and resurrection: to know the only true God and take hold of this present life by the direction and abundant strength afforded to us by through the Spirit.

Wow. Ortberg was brilliant. "Disciples are hand crafted not mass produced." I can only think of one pastor in the 15 years of my Christian walk I would say was interested in hand crafting versus mass producing.

By the way, speaking of the gospel, here is Rick McKinley's definition (taken from Trevin Wax "Kingdom People" blog):

“Sometimes it seems as though we find two gospels in the New Testament–the gospel of Jesus and the gospel about Jesus. The gospel of Jesus is usually taken to mean His announcement of the kingdom and the life He embodied in His loving actions toward the world. The gospel about Jesus refers to his atoning work on the cross and His resurrection, through which we can receieve the forgiveness of sin through our faith and repentance.

“I believe, however, that the two are actually one gospel and that when we lose the tension that comes from holding both together, we experience an unhealthy and unbiblical pendulum swing in our faith.

“If all we value is the salvation gospel, we tend to miss the rest of Christ’s message. Taken out of context of the kingdom, the call to faith in Christ gets reduced to something less than what the New Testament teaches. The reverse is also true: if we value a kingdom gospel at the expense of the liberating message of the Cross and the empty tomb and a call to repentance, we miss a central tenet of kingdom life. Without faith in Jesus, there is no transferring of our lives into the new world of the kingdom.”

- Rick McKinley, This Beautiful Mess

Ed,

Thanks brother for continuing the dialogue. I certainly agree that if one is going to make a claim to what the gospel is he should certainly at least mention the death of Christ and what that means.

Re: your gospel summary - I think that it's good. It contains what I think is the core of the gospel message (Christ's life, death, and resurrection and what makes that intelligible, namely our sinfulness and God's holiness). I love the theme of reconciliation with God that is used in your summary. Mentioning the kingdom established, or taking hold of this present life by the Holy Spirit are necessary and tied tightly to that gospel center. Am I not seeing the kingdom theme accurately to not put it at the center?

As far as critique, if I can offer my fallible thoughts, would be that how we receive the work of Christ is part of the gospel and should be mentioned (namely faith). Isn't that the issue in Galatians with a "different gospel" which is no gospel at all? What do you think?

I know you were speaking to church leaders, Ed...but you really reached me as well. I want to be selfless and let the Lord put me on whatever mission He wants for me.

Thanks for your talk. I feel that I'm not serving from the overflow of a passion and intimacy with God. You said: "If you don't think you struggle with it now, you will along your journey." I thought that last year. Well here I am now. I was encouraged by your talk brother and want to encounter God afresh today and stop watching the nines!

Encounter God, lead others in relationship with God, serve out of the overflow, mission is reflecting the glory of God by being with Jesus, those on mission no longer live for themselves. So preach the gospel to yourself and to others.

That makes our discussion on the gospel (above) important!

Great Job Ed.

Mission is the opposite of Self.

I know I try to find directions for both to go in...

Great Job Ed!

Love your heart and how you use the pulpit that God has given you.

Wonderful Job. It's all about being on God's mission not our personal excursion. Timely words. thanks

I think Hirsch answered the discussion on the Gospel. I like his stuff a lot. Incredibly deep yet brilliantly simple.

I want to read The Forgotten Ways. Ed, Is that going to be required for your missional missiology class at Re:train? I'm sure whatever you require us to read will be great.

Does every pastor have a goatee? YIKES! Love you guys... good info today. Get a razor =)

The Leadership Network commentary on my talk is posted. I thought it was funny so I am reproducing it here (start from the bottom and go up):

5:22 Ed is still dropping weight. I think he will be the size of a 5th grader by Catalyst.

5:22 2 Corinthians 5:14-15 – Mission is the opposite of self

5:21 3. Those on mission no longer live for their own lives

5:21 They need to say – they have been with Jesus

5:21 We reflect the glory of the Lord

5:21 2 Corinthians 3:16-18

5:20 2. Those on mission reflect being with God

5:19 Here I am send me

5:19 Isaiah 6:8 – confession filled, gospel centered lives

5:19 Ministry out of overflow

5:19 Focus not on the work of the Lord but the Lord of the Work

5:19 1. Those on mission focus on God’s glory and His agenda.
5:19 Ed is a Catalyst speaker this year. And he always hangs out with the Leadership Network folks so come around and see Ed. (what's left of him)

5:18 Three ways:

5:17 How do we lay down before God?

5:17 A rethink about Pastoral Ministry

5:15 We get to thinking about prestige, professionalism, expectations

5:15 You have to consistently work to make it about God’s glory

5:14 The mission is opposite of self

5:14 Ed is speaking at Catalyst again this year...

5:14 Ed is the President of Lifeway Research. You can read his blog at edstetzer.com or follow him on Twitter @edstetzer.

For all of the talk about 'size not being the mark of success', the organizers of this online conference seem to have only picked leader/speakers who are 'mega'.

I am enjoying most of the presentations. Picking up a lot of gems. Just an observation.

To those who said, "I'm not a church leader, but I'm getting a lot out of this."

You may not have a named position in leadership, but everyone is a leader, because leadership is influence, and we all influence somebody (to paraphrase Maxwell). Whether you speak from a platform, watch babies in the nursery, or just smile and shake somebody's hand in the hallway, your attitude and motivation in doing it affects those around you.

So you are a leader. That's why you fnid this information helpful.

Ed

Hmmm? Leadership?

Just wondering how you reconcile
the use of the word “leader”
with what Jesus said in Mt 23:10.

The word “leader”seems like
a “high place.” Yes?

Jesus always took and recommended
the “low place.” Yes?

Jesus humbled Himself,
made himself of no reputation
and took on the form of a servant.
Php 2:7

Jesus in Mat 23:10 told His disciples “NOT” to call
themselves master/“leaders”
for you have one master/"leader” the Christ.

King James Version -
Neither be ye called masters:
for one is your Master, even Christ.

The Interlinear Bible -
Nor be called leaders,
for one is your leader the Christ.

Phillips Modern English -
you must not let people
call you leaders,
you have only one leader, Christ.

Today's English Version -
nor should you be called leader,
your one and only leader
is the Messiah.

The Amplified-
you must not be called
masters (leaders)
for you have one master (leader)
the Christ.

Jesus told His disciples “not”
to be called "leaders"
and none did.

Ro 1:1 Paul,
a servant of Jesus Christ...

Php 1:1 Paul and Timotheus,
the servants of Jesus Christ...

Col 4:12 Epaphras, who is one of you,
a servant of Christ...

Tit 1:1 Paul, a servant of God...

Jas 1:1 James, a servant of God...

2Pe 1:1 Simon Peter, a servant...

His disciples "all" called themselves "servants,"
none called themselves "leaders." None? None.
None called themselves
"servant-leader." None.

If someone
calls them self a "leader"
or thinks they are a "leader;"

Are they a "disciple of Christ?"

Wondering some more.

Most on the list of people
at this “leadership?” event
are not only considered “ leaders?”
but also have the “Title” “Pastor.”

Where in the Bible does it say “pastor = leader?”

Have you done your own study
on pastors?
I mean in the Bible?
What does the Bible say
about pastors?

Makes an interesting study.

Here’s some questions to ask
as you check out pastors.

In the Bible, How many people...
have the title pastor?

In the Bible, How many people are...
referred to as pastor?

In the Bible, How many people are...
ordained as a pastor?

In the Bible, How many congregations are...
led by a pastor?

Be blessed in your search for truth... Jesus

And other sheep I have,
which are not of this fold:
them also I must bring,
and they shall hear my voice;
and there shall be one fold,
and one shepherd.
John 10:16

One Fold - One Shepherd - One Voice.
If Not Now, When?

Be blessed and be a blessing.

A. Amos Love,

wow...

A. Amos Love,

Relax.